The Buzz with ACT-IAC
The Buzz with ACT-IAC
Leadership and Collaboration Strategies in a Hybrid World
In this episode of The Buzz podcast by ACT IAC, the focus is on our Voyagers program, a leadership development initiative aimed at emerging leaders across federal government and industry. We get to talk with Ankur Saini, CTO at the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, and Robert Turman, Director of Consulting and Delivery at CGI Federal. They discuss their paths to leadership, the vital role of creativity and adaptability, and how participation in ACT-IAC's programs has shaped their careers. The episode also highlights the importance of professional development programs and concludes with the game 'Acronym Wars.'
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Intro/Outro Music: See a Brighter Day/Gloria Tells
Courtesy of Epidemic Sound
(Episodes 1-159: Intro/Outro Music: Focal Point/Young Community
Courtesy of Epidemic Sound)
yohanna: [00:00:00] Welcome back to the Buzz. Uh, this is the podcast from ACT iac, where we explore the ideas, people and programs driving innovation across government and industry. Today we're diving into the ACT, IAC Voyagers program, a leadership development initiative for rising leaders across federal government and industry.
yohanna: So this model is designed to, for true collaboration, but with the rapid shifts happening. You know, just across government, that ratio is kind of evolving. Uh, and so instead of seeing this as a challenge, our leaders are seizing it as an opportunity. We see that shift and we get creative over here. We're trying something new.
yohanna: Joining me today are Ankur Saini, chief Technology Officer at the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration, and Robert Turman, director of Consulting and Delivery at CGI Federal. They're here to share their perspectives on leadership, their participation with the Voyagers program, and what these changes mean for future collabor.
yohanna: All right, so let's start. [00:01:00] Um, I like starting from the beginning. I, I like just understanding people, you know, their journey, who they are, where they come from, and then how they ended up, I guess, in, in government. So, let's start with you, Encore. Um, a little bit of your background and what brought you to your current position.
yohanna: Great.
ankur: Um, Yoana, thank you for having, uh, me and, uh, Rob. Uh, we are excited to have this conversation. What brought me to the government? So if I told you that. Ever since I was a little kid, all I wanted to do with, uh, was to be a CTO at the Federal Motor Care Safety Administration. That would be a blatant lie.
ankur: Um, 'cause that's not what kids grow up to be. Right. Um, I was born in, um, new Delhi, India. I, I grew up there. Uh, and I moved to the states, uh, when I was 20 years old. And, um, as circumstances would have it like 45 days before nine 11. So my experience for the [00:02:00] first or second year of, uh, me moving here was, uh, interesting to say the least.
ankur: So as we are in this situation today, being creative about how we are going about things, I had to be a lot more creative about how to go about, uh, charting out a career as a 20-year-old in a, in an economy that was. Trailing from the.com bubble, uh, bursting and, uh, you know, the aftershocks of nine 11 and, you know, being an immigrant during that time.
ankur: So there, there was lots of variables to deal with. So I did get creative. Uh, I had moved into the DC area, which meant I was destined to be either working for the government or working for somebody that was supporting the government. And, uh. As fate would have it, I, I found a, I found a job working with the National Cancer Institute within, uh, NIH uh, during my early [00:03:00] days it was doing peripheral IT stuff, but creatively, I, I created a niche for myself there where I was doing a lot more creative work in terms of supporting research, creating posters, and helping the research staff do a lot of analysis and whatnot alongside, I did my MBA from, um.
ankur: University of Maryland, Smith School, and once I graduated out of, uh, my MBA, I moved into truly technology positions that were doing, uh, infrastructure support, software development, um, and, and then the whole gamut supporting the federal government. And over the next few years, you know, I, I, I moved progressively up the chain.
ankur: I got more skills in terms of writing proposals, responding to RFPs and RQs, and doing business development. So yeah, over the next few years, I, I ran my own organizations within small businesses. And then in 2016, an opportunity [00:04:00] opened up with the GSA, where, uh, I had the opportunity to go in as a federal employee, uh, to modernize one of the, one of the critical systems that GSA ran at that point, uh, which is the lease, uh, leasing management system for the entire federal government.
ankur: Called gre, uh, gss real Estate Estate Exchange. Over my course of working with the government for 10, 15 years, at that point, uh, I had always wondered, you know, the amount of impact you can make when you are. Somebody from the outside making or recommending changes versus somebody who can drive the change from the inside.
ankur: And I was always fascinated by the opportunities that existed within the federal government to make that, you know, wholesale widespread changes. So given that opportunity opened up, I grabbed both my hands and, and, uh, over the next couple of years modernize the system. And, um, and then. 2020. I, I, I got this role of, uh, CTO at, uh, [00:05:00] federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration.
ankur: And, uh, I've been here since then. Again, the coincidences I've been, uh, a part of my life. The day I signed the job offer letter, a week later, the government shut down for COVID, which, which made this job super interesting during the first year as well. Um, but yeah, that's a, that's a little bit of a window into my, uh, you know.
ankur: Entry into the government, uh, or working with the government, how I got into the government and now where, where I am. So it was definitely not a straightforward path, and I only not one that I could have either planned for or I had ever planned for. How
yohanna: did you meet Act iac? How did you stumble? Stumble upon us
ankur: as, as I said, you know, I, I, I, I grew up in this area, right?
ankur: So like from a 20-year-old kid to now, I've, I've worked with a lot of, uh, small businesses. I worked in 15 different government agencies and through my, uh, through my work and, you know, building relationships [00:06:00] with, with folks, I, I ran across a lot of folks that, that had gone through the partners program, the, the, uh, the Voyagers program.
ankur: And, uh, as I was transitioning into this role in 20 20, 1 of my very good friends. He recommended that I go through the partners program and he had even said, Hey, he, he and I had even started working on the application and then the world shut down for COVID, although the program was going, I always derive a lot more value when we interact with people in person, right?
ankur: So I'm like, I'm, this is ironic because I work in tech, but I, I, I, I don't l like to have 100% of my interactions with somebody over a screen. Right. It, to me, learning and collaborating and building relationships is, is a lot easier when we, when we are in person, we're sitting together and, you know, we're sharing a meal, we're having a conversation with, so, [00:07:00] because I couldn't get that in an online setting, I, I had avoided that.
ankur: So when, in 23, when we went back to more of a hybrid model, it was still not, you know, completely in person. Um, I, I welcome that opportunity to go through the Partners program and, uh, I, it was, it was absolutely fantastic. I, I think I've made connections and relationships with folks that are gonna last me a lifetime.
ankur: Uh, got the opportunity to meet wonderful people and, um, you know, and, and I continue to do so. I mean, Rob and I met. Uh, a few weeks ago, and, you know, we, we had not gone through the same program, but every time I go to an Act Hiac event, you know, it, it, it gives me an opportunity to walk into an event where I am certain to meet familiar faces.
ankur: But also I get to meet new folks that, uh, that I'm, that I've never met.
yohanna: Yeah, that's good. That's great. [00:08:00] Yeah. Last night we had an event that was really fun. I met new, new people and everybody kind of just say, says the same thing. I was, I did associates, I did fellows, I did partners, I did, you know, et cetera.
yohanna: Such a, so that's really good to hear. It's the, it's a consistent message, you know. What's your message, Rob?
ROB: Um, I'm, I'd probably be a, uh, a little more straightforward since my career was, um, uh, really at one place, but my background, personal background, important things first. Uh, husband to my lovely wife, Katie for 10 years now, father to a six and a 4-year-old boy.
Odin and Augie. They're, uh, hilarious, morons, intelligent, you know, all the things. Um. But they're, they're, they're amazing. I grew up here in the, on the East coast. Uh, my dad was in the Navy, so we were stationed down in, in, uh, the Norfolk area, um, as a kid moved up, um, when he got stationed at the Pentagon into Maryland area.
Went to University of Nebraska for college, go Big Red. I think this [00:09:00] was gonna be our year. Um, I really hope so. And, uh, and then we, uh, uh, I came back as soon as I graduated from college. I came right back to the East Coast. Uh, by this time I think my, my dad had started working at a government contracting firm after he got outta the Navy.
So that was kind of just like the easy path, honestly was, oh, okay. I, I, I'll get a job here. I think my. You know, Encore, uh, joked about how no child imagines being A-A-A-C-T-O in government, um, as a kid. But I, I, I, I was like close to thinking I was gonna work for GAO and be an accountant. Thankfully, I, I did not do, spend a day of my career actually doing real accounting work, um, for everybody's sake.
Um. But yeah, I went back, worked for a, a, another large si for a, a very brief amount of time, and then started working for CGI shortly after that, and I'm getting close to my 18th year here. Uh, my, [00:10:00] my, uh, my journey here at CGI has been a lot of different roles, which has been great, you know, um, from, uh, financial management stuff to pricing to.
Business operations to business development and, and capture and into, uh, actual client delivery back into, or I was a growth leader for a very brief, uh, amount of time. And then, um, before going into client delivery and then now back into like a BD role. I would say the, the, the catalyst behind all these moves are a couple different things.
Three things. Maybe I'll say. One being, uh, me not being comfortable. Okay. Yeah. Right. Not wanting to, to stay comfortable in what I was doing because I knew that would be limiting my growth capabilities. Um, two, having sponsorship, uh, leadership, um, support in asking you to try something else. [00:11:00] Uh, and then lastly, me saying yes to those things.
Not just, you know, oh, you know, I'm, I'm happy with what I'm doing. I'm gonna keep doing it. So I've got to try a lot of different things that had a lot of different roles at the company. Probably half were me asking for something. The other half were someone saying, you need, I want you to go and do this for me now.
Um, and, uh. Uh, it, it's been, it's been great as far as coming into act iac, I can't remember exactly the selling point of why I should get involved. I know it was probably, uh, since I was a Voyagers 2018, it was at least two or three years before then. 'cause I, I was trying to get into Voyagers 17 and CGI selected somebody else that year.
Um. She knows who she is. She's not with this company with CGI anymore. And, uh, so I, I, uh, I got to get picked, uh, in the next year, but there was probably at least two or three years before my actual class that I, I had been interested in wanting to get involved and trying to build my own [00:12:00] resume to, to be selected both by CGI and by the, uh, the fellows community that, that does the judging.
So, and I think the selling point was something like, oh, this person's a fellow and this person's a fellow and this person's a fellow. Oh, those are all really impressive people. I would love to be in that same community. Yeah. Um, but I don't remember exactly what the selling point was and I've just stayed involved since then.
You know, doing as a handful of different things. I could, you know, it, uh, beyond the program itself, uh, I was a. A coach for the Associates program my year and I, this is my second year doing Voyagers leadership. And then outside of that, trying to contribute what I can to the ELC program, you know, the, the planning around that.
There's, there's a lot of really smart people that are involved in that planning though, so it's like you have to really elbow your way into to make a difference. But getting involved in ELC, getting involved in the federal insights exchanges, so on and so forth, um, that's how I've stayed en engaged.
Since graduating.
yohanna: Speaking of which, there was somebody that told me at ELC, we [00:13:00] do a costume party, like, because it's around, you know, Halloween and stuff. And then they were like, they took me to the side, like, like who's, who's organizing that? And I'm like, oh, I, I am brand new here. I have no idea. Like, but can you pass my word all?
yohanna: I'm like, I don't, I don't know how to do back, back like backdoor deals. Like what do you, I dunno. Costume. So I dunno if who's organizing the costume?
Rob: Just taking the money. Just taking the money. I, I think, yeah, I think the costing party kind of just
happens. Yeah,
yohanna: it does. That's what I heard. Yeah.
It's, it's not, it's not, it's, it's like a, it's like a theme that just kind of evolves as we get closer to ELC and, uh, things just fall in place.
It's not like a
ankur: official thing that happens there. I think a couple of years ago there was, uh, there was an official announcement made that it was gonna be, hmm. Halloween themed, but
yeah, I, I have not brought a costume from the ELC, but I have been in costume. Someone had extra costumes that I got to borrow.
Yeah,
yohanna: [00:14:00] so I'm looking forward to it. I have no idea what's gonna happen. It's gonna be my first ELC and I hope to get like interviews and stuff there. What I'm hearing is that our. Programs have helped you in your individual careers. Are there any, um, examples that you wanna share about how going through an ACT, IAC professional development program helps you in your day-to-day?
yohanna: Uh, you know, just leadership and technology and
ankur: so I'll, I'll start and I, I have a certain framework in my head that I've, you know, come up with over the last couple of years in terms of how I, how I visualize the, the ACT iac. Different professional development programs, the associates, the Voyagers, and the partners.
ankur: So the way I see those three programs associates is more for, you know, folks that are pretty early career, uh, and, uh, they aspire to be in an executive position somewhere down the line, but they're just getting [00:15:00] their feedback right now. So it's not, it's not, it's, it's, it's not a, it's not a done deal in terms of what that path looks like.
ankur: They, they may have all, they may have options and Associates is designed to, you know, explore those options for them so that, you know, they can take some. Voyagers is more for folks that are like, are individual contributors right now or have just been promoted into some management position and they either are doing work.
ankur: Today that is dependent on other folks, or they will soon be doing some work. They'll be, you know, dependent on the efforts of others. So going from an individual contributor to a, a manager is, is a significant transition. Right? So when you're, when you're an ic, you control a hundred percent what you do when you become a manager, you're success kind of, sort of.
ankur: Depends on how effective you are as a leader of the team versus, you know, just, you know, you, you can brute force your way through a [00:16:00] week, two weeks, three weeks, but over years it'll catch up. So having that situational awareness and, and these skills to manage or lead a team that you may or may not have picked yourself, right, because you, you don't get green fields to play with all the time.
ankur: You walk into organizations by accepting a job and. You have a team of 20 people and you're like, yeah, I wouldn't have hired those five people, or these are five superstars. You don't know what the makeup of the team is, but you can only go to war with the Army you have. Right? So Voyager helps you navigate some of those things.
ankur: And then Partners is more of folks that are already in well-established leadership PO positions, but either they're going from a senior management role into an executive role, or they're already have their one foot. Through it. So how do you now transition from a, a management role into having an executive presence and, you know, somewhat navigating the politics of an organization?
ankur: To [00:17:00] me, partners did provide me a good understanding of, you know, how, how to navigate some of those high level challenges. And I had some solid takeaways in terms of how I can. You know, manage different personalities at work or, you know, um, you know, we, we had a, we had a great session on, uh, brand was a brand under fire, right.
ankur: Which was crisis management and how to protect your brand image while there's a crisis going on. Right. Like, I work in a safety organization, right. And the, the downside of working in a safety organization is. It's sort of a thankless job. You are, you are always judged by how many failures rather than how many successes, right?
ankur: Are, are. The mission of our agency is to prevent fatalities and injuries from large trucks and bus crashes, right? [00:18:00] Nobody thinks about us when nothing's going on, which is, which is status quo. It's like nobody, as soon as a truck hits somebody and somebody dies. And then it's like the, the focus is on us, right?
ankur: So we are, we are judged by failures, not successes. So for us, that brand management under that situation is a real thing, day in, day out, right? So I can see some of those things in actions and, and, and I can help the executive leadership. Make some of those decisions that are gonna protect the name of the organization in a way, uh, that it, that, that we should be thinking about.
ankur: So, um, so yeah, there's, there's, there's definitely actionable takeaways from, from all the programs that we Yeah. That, that we participate
in.
yohanna: That's good. Did you wanna add anything to that? Sure.
Um, I would break it down into two things. First, there's the. [00:19:00] Education that is very straightforward. You're sitting there and you're listening.
You're receiving information about how to become a better leader or whatever. The second is the experiences and, and that's the, the things that everyone's gonna be very different, their experiences that. That one person's gonna get is gonna be different from the experiences that their classmates are gonna get.
Um, but the majority of what those things are, those experiences are even the, even the education are directed towards leadership. But the experiences are about relationship building. And what leadership really is, is understanding how you can create relationships, uh, to get to outcomes, right? Whatever the outcome is that your organization is working towards.
Um. So in these, in this program, as long as you have the humility to not believe that you know everything, to listen and to really, truly gain those experiences, um, uh, to, to, to live into those experiences, uh, then, then, [00:20:00] then that's when you're really gonna benefit greatly from this, the program like Voyagers,
yohanna: the humility, listen.
yohanna: That's a tough one. 'cause you have to be brave to be humble too. Like Oh, and, and v vulnerable to be humble. I think there's, you know, those are, I feel like they're feelings that compliment each other, you know? Right.
ankur: And, and you bring up a good point, like being brave, like having the courage to, yeah. To, to do something.
ankur: But I think, I, I think that is, that is table stakes in doing everything right. So, you know, people talk about integrity being a huge value. Yeah, it is. But you, you, you need to have courage to be, to be true to that integrity. Right? Everybody will do the right thing. When things are easy, things become really difficult, then can you do the right thing?
ankur: Right? And if you don't have the courage to do it, then mm-hmm. Yeah. Everything is. Everything becomes survival tactics and then there's no integrity. Mm-hmm. Or nothing else. [00:21:00]
yohanna: Yeah. What I like about the Voyagers program, it's kind of like right in the middle, so you're old enough to know better, right? Like you graduated from college, you graduated from associates, you know what's going on.
yohanna: Um, it's also built on, uh, OPMs executive core of qualifications and has always emphasized collaboration by pairing. Rising leaders from the government and industry. Why do you think the, the, our original model that we have, where we pair is kind of powerful? Can you guys speak on the model that we, that we have when it comes to voyagers?
You know, Anker, you gave me a, a moment to pause and think about what I want to say last time. So I'll, I'll do that this time. Uh, for you, um, from the industry perspective, why the, the, uh, ECQ. These are a great foundation for the program is one, it kind of puts you, uh, uh, on the industry side in the shoes, understanding what is expected out of our government leadership, what are the things that they need to be held accountable towards being someone that's been [00:22:00] 18 years in industry.
That's not something I was really privy to until going through the program. So, uh, I really appreciated it. Understanding a little bit more about what my, my colleagues on the other side of the, uh, the fence. Were, uh, what they needed to do, what they, what they needed to be, what they needed to live up to, to be considered a successful person in their role.
Um, so that's, I I do think it's helpful from both sides. One, giving the game plan for government executive as well as, uh, educating the, the industry person on what it is that the, the government person needs to do.
ankur: Yeah. So I think, Rob, you, you hit the nail on the head. It, it's all about perspective, right?
ankur: So whether you are. Selling a product or you are building software or you're building systems, you have to, like, what's the number one advice that you get all the time? Like the number one advice you get all the time is spend a day in the shoes of your customer. Right. Um, [00:23:00] through my zigzag way of surviving in this gulf con industry for the, for the last 20 years, I've had one of, one, I've had the opportunity to work in.
ankur: The GovCon space for 15, 20 years before I transitioned into, um, being a federal employee. So I've seen, I've seen this game being played from both sides, right? Not everybody has that opportunity. I think pairing industry folks with the government folks allows those two people that have purely worked in the, on the industry side or purely worked in the government side to observe the same situation.
ankur: From the perspective of the others, right? So, and I'll give you an example. We all proposals are the bane of everybody's existence, right? In, in, in, in, in the private sector. Acquisition is also the bane of existence for everybody on, on the government side, right? It's, it's [00:24:00]
like we, we have acquisition problems.
The industry has acquisition problems, but there are different problems,
ankur: right? So. By bringing those two perspectives together, we can have a better understanding of, Hey, this is the problem I face. What can you help do on your side so that I don't have that problem? And what can the government do on our side so that the folks that are writing proposals to our requirements don't have, don't have those problems?
ankur: So it, it is very important for the producer of that information to connect with the consumer of that information so that this information exchanges. Efficient. So, and I think pairing folks from the industry side and the government side allows you to sort of cross that membrane and, and, and facilitate that exchange of information.
yohanna: Yeah. And then, and also I think we're doing it live, you know, we're doing it on the spot. We're not understanding this perspective, like in hindsight, we're understanding it like, you know, live and, and direct. So that's, [00:25:00] that's pretty good. Yeah, I like that. Have you both seen, uh, how the program can impact our participants?
yohanna: Have you seen any light bulbs kind of
go off? Well, the easiest thing or the most impactful thing is. When you think about lives, livelihood, we're all in this. We're getting a paycheck from somebody, right? You know, either our government agencies or our industry, uh, companies. Looking back at last year's class, there was so much change in such a short amount of time.
And I'm not here to say that you know, it, it was good or bad. I'm here to say that it was different and it was impactful to people. Um, and they, they rallied around each other. In a very, uh, motivational way. I don't know how else to say it. You know, it was, it was, it was really encouraging to see, to witness, to see people that were fearful about what may be next for them to see people that had been directly impacted, that, you know, the, their companies or their, their, their [00:26:00] agencies identified these people as good candidates for them to spend extra money on and go through a program so that they can give back their new skills to their organizations.
Those people were also being impacted by losing their jobs and whatnot, and seeing their classmates help them try to find, uh, landing spots to help them with their resumes and, and so on and so forth. So, I could say, you know, there's probably a lot of minor impacts that these programs and, uh, have, have imprinted on the,
yohanna: yeah,
the, the, the participants.
But the most impactful was reassurance that they were not in it alone. Spending time of massive change.
ankur: And I was gonna say something, Rob, that you finished a sentence off so. They're often these situations where you feel like you're on an island and this is only happening to you. And, and seeing the community rally not on just what has happened mm-hmm.
ankur: To the folks that, that, that Rob was mentioning. But even [00:27:00] somebody having an issue with, you know, a, a, a certain requirement, like an implementation of a system or something like that. And them, them thinking like, maybe this is just a one-off thing. And using your team as a sounding board. They're like, oh no, we've had this problem and then we did something about it.
ankur: And that sparks a, sparks an idea, a conversation, and it it tells people that they're not alone. Right? So this is, this is, you're not on an island. This is the problem. Yes, you are going through it, but other folks have gone through, through the same thing as well. Um, so. It offers a good support system for, for, for folks, but even let's talk happy times.
ankur: Right? So I've, I've seen a lot of folks that, you know, they, they went through RSS or partners, and now they're, you know, SES is in organizations. They're, they're, they're, they're running programs and CIO shops and CTO shops across the federal government. I, I know folks that are now at very senior [00:28:00] level positions with, with big consulting firms.
ankur: So, um. There's, there's a lot of this talent that is out there, and whether we admit it or not, whether we like it or not, we are all a part of the same value chain, right? When, when the government agencies wanna do something, it, it starts off with the whole budgeting process and it comes down to the point where we need to issue a contract to do some stuff.
ankur: Then we go out to the industry to get the expertise and the talent to do that, do that thing. And that's where generally the, the interaction between the government and the, and the private sector has to shine to deliver on that outcome. Having a network that is very interconnected allows you to solve problems when things go a little bit south on a project.
ankur: Right? So for example, if, [00:29:00] if Rob was. In charge of a company and Encore is working on the government side trying to implement something, and we're going, we're, we're having issues on a, uh, on a contract. Rather than going through this whole concept of, you know, holding somebody accountable and, you know, pointing fingers and, and, and writing somebody up.
ankur: I can pick up the phone and say, Hey Rob, we are having this issue. Can we sit down around, around the same table and, and sort it out? That happens when you have, when you have some element of baseline trust, right? Um, but if it, if it doesn't exist, then yeah, you're gonna have a write-up. Uh, and, and write-ups help in holding people accountable.
ankur: They don't help in building trust.
yohanna: So what I'm, so what I'm hearing is that you guys are adaptive and you guys are resilient. And you guys pivot when you know you need to pivot, you get creative. When you know you need, you know, there's, there needs to be a change. Uh, and that makes me feel good that there are folks out there that are mindful of, of all the things that [00:30:00] they make in control.
yohanna: All right, so we've been having a great conversation. These dudes are really smart. We're gonna bring back acronym wars, and this is the game that I've created where I tell our participants the letters of a government agency and they have to tell me what that agency is.
Rob: Hmm.
yohanna: Are you ready?
Rob: I was ready. Be, yeah, let's go.
Rob: Let's go. You're going down. Anchor. I'm, I'm, I am. I am hyper competitive. Just, just there. Just,
just as an FYI. Okay.
yohanna: Okay. Here's the first one. Here's the first one. FDIC.
ankur: Oh. Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation.
yohanna: Good job. That was quick. That was a quick one.
All right. Are is it like just first to start talking by the way, or is it, it's like the buzzers in mouth. That's the kind, guess. Basic.
yohanna: I'll, I'll determine if you guys both start talking at the same time, I'll [00:31:00] just, I'll, you know, I'll pick, I'll pick who I heard first. All right. Here's the second one. CFTC.
Commodities and Future Trading Corporation
yohanna: Close. Oh, it's that corporation. It's.
Commission
yohanna: for the steel? For the steel encore? For the steel.
Oh, I, I didn't wanna steal it. I was just trying to finish it off. I, I, I would, I would not have gotten that one. I, I, I tell you off the board,
Rob: I couldn't think of another key word.
yohanna: All right. Here's uh, the third one. PBGC oh, pension and benefits grant commission close, not grant guarantee. There you go. Oh, steal you.
yohanna: All right, here's the last one. Here's the last one. We'll go with M-A-R-A-D.
Oh, MARAD, [00:32:00] maritime, uh, administration.
yohanna: Yes. Nice. Good job.
That's, that was, yeah, that was us. DOT. Shame. Shame. Well, uh, uh, saying it, uh, you know, spelling it out like confus me. I had to, uh, had to pause, like, oh, merit. No, I, so I, I had maritime administration, but I was like, it can't be just.
Two words. I, yeah, I have the same, I have the same length of acronym I have, like, I don't even know how many words in the Federal Military Safety
yohanna: Administration, so good job. I'm like, I should bring it back. I put a pause on acronym war. I was like, I don't, I don't know if people like this. I'm gonna, I don't know if this is weird.
yohanna: But it looks like folks are enjoying themselves. This is, that's great. Thank you so much. This
is like wisdom of the crowd. Like between me and Rob, we got a hundred percent.
yohanna: Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much. Yeah. So that's the end of our podcast. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you for, uh, playing along to acronym WARS and your leadership.
yohanna: Uh, I know that our incoming Voyagers [00:33:00] class. Is lucky to have you. If folks can reach out to you, please let them know if maybe a LinkedIn message, um, is that, is that okay?
That that's that's fine. If they want to, absolutely.
yohanna: All right. Great. And for our listeners, if you're a rising leader looking, uh, to step into the future of government and industry collaboration, I encourage you to learn about.
yohanna: At DAC programs, um, this has been the buzz. I'm your host Yohanna Baez. Until next time, stay curious, stay collaborative, stay connected. Thank you so much. Thank you. All right. Have a good day.
Rob: Thank you.